I recently remarked in a comment on someone's blog that I only had a couple of posts in drafts. Then I clicked on the draft button and I realised I had quite a few unpublished posts, this being one that was never finished and I am not sure where I was going with it. Mother died in 2023, so the post must have written before then, but not too long before she died.
Gay male bloggers have one thing in common, well two because they also blog. They may have other things in common, but that is nothing to do with them being gay. Gay men of a certain age often do seek affirmation that they are not abnormal and so are naturally attracted to other gay bloggers. It has been our life to seek being accepted for who we are, individually or as a couple.
But that is as far as it goes. Personalities start to come into it as they do with whoever you may come across in the world of blog.
I've been dumped by bloggers who I quite liked and I am well aware that I can be challenging at times and I suspect only a couple of times because I am gay and the person didn't initially realise. It will be about what I say rather than what I am.
We visit a bakery about once a week, different days, for me ham, tomato and onion white bread sandwich. I swear it makes the best white bread in Melbourne. This day I changed to a curried egg and lettuce sandwich on white bread. There are four large long tables outside and we prefer to sit at outside, no matter the weather. This day there was one free table, with two bench seats, one of which was wet. Fine, we can sit side by side. I draped my jacket (yes, jacket on the hottest month of our year) over the table to note ownership as I went to a rubbish bin to dump the bird crap laden sponge into a bin that I had cleaned off the car but that didn't stop a couple coming along and sitting at the other end of the table, well not until she cleaned off the seat with serviettes, and she brought some for R to clean off his side of the bench. She was Asian born with a white male partner and she was well known to the owners and staff who all greeted her.
She had a dog with her. His name was Toby. I remarked to her that we once had dog called Toby. Does that sound innocent? It did as I said it.
Yet, with the word we, I had just outed ourselves and that we had been together for a long time. The woman didn't bat an eyelid, as she shouldn't. She replied, our Toby can be a very naughty dog, was yours?
Ex Sis in Law told us that one day on car trip home from our place that one of her then teen children asked if Uncle Andrew and Uncle R are gay. She answered them honestly and appropriately.
Yet she also told us that when my father was dying and all family was there, one of my step mother's male grandchildren asked, 'Who are those old poofs?' Please, I was only early forties, not so old. Mid teen Oldest Niece piped up to her mother and said, I just knew it. I knew they are gay.
Which version to believe. Maybe the car conversation came after the visit to my dying father.
I ponder whether foreign born Australians face this and in some ways they do. Assumptions are made about them. Mother's cousin's first husband was born of Italian parents. His name is Bruno. Mother's parents did not want to go to the wedding in the inner suburb of Fitzroy where Bruno's family lived. Fitzroy had a reputation. Of course they did attend and very much enjoyed the Italian style wedding.
Mother's newest eye doctor's name is Bruno and she said on the phone, I hope his accent is not too bad. I will need my carer son with me to translate and I will pretend I am deafer than I am. Eye surgeon Bruno is possibly third generation Australian and even if he is not, how good is his eye surgery?
Mother is an absolute shocker for classifying people by race yet she loves Indian born nurses in hospitals because they are so kind, as was her former Filipina neighbour.
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There will always be bigots and some of them take pleasure in making other people feel uncomfortable. We're all people.
ReplyDeleteSadly true JB.
DeleteThe most chilling form is the bigotry that seems casual to the speaker. And the targeted person ALWAYS knows it when they hear it. No excuses, your generation, culture etc. None.
ReplyDeleteBoud, I understand what you mean, and it amazes me that a few people do it so openly and without apology.
DeleteRace, sex, colour, sexual orientation, social class... we all get classified by others most of the time whether we like it or not. I suppose it is human nature to need to place others in "boxes" .
ReplyDeleteI don't always like my box 😒
JayCee, yes we do all get boxed, and I as much like the next person in that area.
DeleteI try hard (and sometimes fail) not to be bigoted. And yes, both my parents were racist and unashamed. They also happily made exceptions to their bigotry and had friends from the categories they denigrated. As I have commented on my own blog my father talked about pink shirt poofs (shudder) and one of my most successful gifts to him was a burgundy silk shirt which he loved. He wore and wore it until it was undeniably pink. And continued to wear it.
ReplyDeleteThat's a funny story about your father EC. Do you think if he was youngish now, would he not have such opinions? Or at least, keep them more to himself.
DeleteI know not. I hope so. I really hope so.
DeleteThere’s always someone who thinks they’re funny by pointing the finger - pointedly but in an underhand manner.
ReplyDelete“I wouldn’t say that”…..but you did we say to ourselves - unheard by them
Yes Cathy, lol. The do say what they wouldn't.
DeleteThe pursuit of external validation is a common tendency among many individuals. Engaging with a community through blogging likewise fosters personal connection and growth.
ReplyDeleteRoentare, we all want to fit in somewhere.
DeleteThank goodness times have changed to some extent, but not enough. As lesbian teachers my partner and I back in the 90s were very discreet simply because so many people were under the impression we would interfere with their children. Why would we , we are not peodophiles ,but that was often the assumption. Since I had been married previously . and had two sons it also made people assume I was”normal”
ReplyDeleteTimes have changed so much , gay teachers and gay students are the norm . We are now in our mid 60s and 70s and no longer have to be discreet , in fact haven’t been for at least 20 years.
In our hospitals in Adelaide we have many Nepalese nurses, we had the most delicious Indian tradesperson repairing an appliance yesterday . In the medical practice we attend we have the most amazing doctors from many nations . As for young Indian men driving Ubers in Melbourne while studying, the conversations we have had with them about cooking cricket and their families in India have been wonderful
People just need to look at themselves and work out how they can be better human beings rather than be concerned about how others live their decent fulfilling lives
I think lesbians become even more invisible than straight women do when they are older. Gay men to younger gay men certainly do. When I am in country areas where there are fewer non white people, I feel a little strange, as if I am not quite in my world. Of your tradesperson could have been a woman, but assuming it was a man, I am pleased you can recognise a delicious man. I am not one who talks in cabs. I don't like to have be polite about outrageous statements and opinions some drivers make, although that is mostly white and European drivers, and there aren't too many of them left now.
DeleteWe are all human, so that's a good starting point.
ReplyDeleteIt should be Bob, but it soon goes quite wrong from there.
DeleteGenerally speaking I have to watch myself around those heavy duty Christians. I can be somewhat un-fair to such people. Or just plain NOT nice. Enjoyed your post.
ReplyDeleteI would not mind that at all Dora.
DeleteWhenever somebody new pops up in my "follower" section, I always give that person's own blog a look over (at least until recently when Blogger mysteriously made that more difficult.) About eight years ago I found out a new follower was gay. He wouldn't be following me because I also was gay as I hadn't brought the subject up much at that point. I guess he just liked the pop culture or political stuff that I ping-pong between on my blog. Now that I knew I had at least one gay follower, I started seeking out other gay bloggers, eventually coming to you, Andrew. My blog is still only occasionally LGBTQ, as my interests go way beyond that subject, but it's nice to know that when I do bring the topic up, there are kindred spirits in the audience.
ReplyDeleteThat's much as I think about it Kirk. Now I am trying to think back to my first gay blogger, well that I knew was gay. It may have a local called Alan who lived in an inner Melbourne suburb. I don't even know how I knew he was gay. His blog was Life Beside the Park, or something like that. I had number of lesbian readers quite early on.
DeletePoofs is a word I haven't heard since I don't know when. Most often I heard queer and now of course it is gay which used to annoy me at first because in older childrens books (Enid Blyton years) the children were often gay, meaning happy. So for me, that word was spoiled, but I got over it.
ReplyDeleteThis was twenty five years ago River, but I'd bet he would still be the same. I still use the word gay in the old sense at times.
DeleteInteresting post Andrew. Haven't heard the word 'poofs' for a very long time.
ReplyDeleteSome people are just like you described, and I gather it's upsetting to those people who are gay or from another country - but I was amused that you wrote,
'Bruno and she said on the phone, I hope his accent is not too bad. I will need my carer son with me to translate and I will pretend I am deafer than I am'.
I understand that your dear mum is from another generation and would think that way when she was with us. I have heard people these days saying some people are hard to understand when they are from another country or born here..
Margaret, I think the difference now it that gay men no longer feel shame or guilt if called names. They are more likely to feel sad for the person who uses such names. "Are you calling me a poof? Tell me something I don't know".
DeleteI think words are confusing as we reuse them in different ways. I see people not labels. Also I have four young adult grandchildren who will give me their analysis of current usage. But on the whole I think we brood over ourselves too much, I mean why are we all on 'the spectrum' ;) according to my daughter.
ReplyDeleteThelma, it does help to have young people around you to understand what they are saying, thinking and their word usage.
DeleteInteresting to unearth an old post that you didn't publish. Getting to "know" some gay men through blogging - yourself included - I feel that I have become a better person. I admit that I was previously quite homosexualist if there is such a term but you guys have educated me. In truth you are all quite different from each other - different stories to tell, different personalities and interests. Being gay is just a little part of who you are.
ReplyDeleteThanks YP. When I was younger, being gay was a much bigger part of me, thankfully reduced by hormones easing their rage.
DeleteThere is often a sort of dance around the topic of sexual orientation. I attended a "game show" in the theater on the ship yesterday. Audience members were selected as contestants. One was a man probably in his 50's maybe early 60's. The host asked if he had anyone with him on the cruise? The answer was "my other half" and the next question was what is her name, the answer was a slightly embarrassed "Mark". A rather attractive and slightly younger man. You could tell it is no secret, but not something we talk about first.
ReplyDeleteTP, you may remember those assumptions are one of my real bugbears. What was the host thinking? Surely a professional host should know better than that, especially if the guy said, my other half, rather than wife or girlfriend. I hope it was the host that was really embarrassed and a lesson was learnt.
DeleteI marvel that your nieces and nephews were uncertain about whether you're gay or not. Admittedly, little kids don't pay attention to such things but I'm pretty sure my nieces have known about me as long as they've known what "gay" means. I don't think it was ever a question.
ReplyDeleteI think it's been a very, very long time since anyone severed a relationship with me -- or even became more distant -- because I'm gay. I think most people have moved beyond that kind of thing nowadays.
Steve, I don't think they spent a lot of their early teenage lives thinking about Uncle Andrew and his friend Uncle Ray. They would have only just learnt what gay was themselves. Yes, it just doesn't happen now, and be very suspicious about someone who does. Scratch the surface and may find a latent underneath.
Delete